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Answered

Jumpshooting

Brat 1 month ago in All Platforms / PC • updated by WW1GameSeries 3 weeks ago 34

Yo, do you plan to do something about jump shooting? It's the most easily

and often abused thing in the game, to the degree when one jumpshooter

can swipe entire trench just bouncing thru the air like in

Wo hu cang long fight scene. I tried it a few times, and it works crazy well. Just by the mouse-keyboard
movement system, it gives you a more steady aim at the enemy who's standing
still than his aim at you when you fly past him, making you the moving target and him the sitting duck. And the flood of
people who jump at each other is steadily rising, breaking the immersion and playing against the existing balance of weapons.

Game Version:
292.12399
Reproduction steps:
Run, and without stopping jump, and while midair just aim and shoot. No punishment for moving and firing like during walking + speed of running while doing so= ultimate tactic against any other player.
Output Log:
Gameplay Weapons

I think a lot of players exploit this by using scripts so that when they jump, they auto ADS, or they have a special jump key that does that or something of the sort. The solution must be to make the game more realistic; the rifle should be absolutely useless while jumping, and if you try shooting in the air, the accuracy should be nonexistant. I estimate that not a single jumpshot was ever preformed during both world wars whatsoever because it's just next to impossible IRL.

I'm a jumpshooter myself, and can 100% confirm i spend ly time home writing little scripts and program macrokeys to auto-ads on jumps in Verdun...

ps. No we don't


just because you don't, doesn't mean no one does. I'm not saying they do, just your anecdotal experience isn't an argument.

come on... This thread has been made countless times before, julpshots have been in the game and will remain in the game. The devs have no intent to remove those any time soon. 

For me, I mainly only jumpshoot to turn corners to kill some tapeworm lying prone in some wall with his mg. And by jumping on him I only try to get this little bit advantage iver him before he can spray me down. Also, the jumping makes me a bigger target than when i wouldn't do it so it's actually even easier to shoot me. 

if you truly want to play the WW1-series without jumpshots ruining your 'immersion' i can truly recommend Tannenberg, where they disabled jumpshots. (But by disabling them also making it a dead game because nobody likes it)

Two things

First: how does jumping make you bigger? Real question here, would like to accelerate the gains

Second: Tannenberg is dead because it's overcomplicated with its lack of trench gameplay and constant running around trying to capture flags and chew thru bots. It feels artificial and dull, and jumpshooting has got nothing or almost nothing to do with it.

1: when turning or peeking a corner you only show z little part of your body, by jumping you show your entire body in the air without any cover anywhere. 

2: soon there will be nice bots in Verdun too, and as far as i know (in my very limited time playing verdun) capturi g the OBJ in tannenberg and trenches on verdun are based on same principle. But if the devs would actually e'able jumpshots in Tannenberg i would really like to pick up the game again

The working of the capturing itself is the same. This way you can say that Warhammer: Mark of Chaos is basically Verdun. It's the fact that you run around the map not even encountering any enemies, but just taking the capture points. Peeking around the corner makes you visible for a longer period of time before you fire. And it serves as a defensive tactic, not every-situation-solver jumpshot.

Tannenberg is unpopular because you can't jumpshoot there? Now I've heard everything! Why do you love jumpshooting so much? It's 100% unthinkable IRL! Why would you miss it if it went? Nobody has yet presented a good point why it's a good thing.

read the above: it's most usefull to get rid of those tapeworms bugging their mg or laying prone in the ground behind a corner. You can't peek them because thry will just mowe you down, by jumping you do something they won't anticipate and so get a few miliseconds adva'tage to try a'd take them out.

True but they are doing something that is realistic and that they are supposed to, while the jumpshooter is performing a circus act. Anyway this might be your use of the phenomenon but there are players who does it all the time, and that is the problem. Jumping around like bunnies and shooting accurately pretty far away. There's no reason that should be possible.

also, stop comparing this with real life ffs. You are PLAYING A GAME, go join a reanactment group or so if you want to shoot ww1 weapons irl. 

That's a point but I wil NOT stop comparing it with real life. Verdun is sort of realistic and that is part of why I like this game so much.

so how sbout 1 man mg-teams, calling in artillery by thought, barbed wire that kills you within seconds, every gun sounding pretty much the same, wrong squads fighting on the wrong battle, 1914 uniforms in 1916 Flanders..... Stop complaining about this one FEATURE a'd just enjoy the game. If you see jumpshooters in your match just aim a bit higher than usual and you will be fine

One can argue that because of all that unrealistic things you mentioned there could be throwing axes and unicorns. Everyone gets that it's not completely realistic, but it only comes from the limitation in the number of players and the size of the map, or technical/performance issues. Another thing is that nobody is safe when the monstered'up cyber-chad from some self-proud clan enters the game and starts racking up k/ds like 20:1 by flying around. Nobody is fine ;____;

nobody is holding you back from investing 2000 hours of your life in this game too.

Yes of course the game isn't 100% realistic, nobody ever claimed that it was, but the examples you make like one man MG teams etc. are that way for good reasons, or they are very difficult for the developers to do something about. Jumpshooting is a different story, to prevent it is very possible and there's no good reason as to why it is currently possible. The game doesn't need jumpshooting to function. The barbed wire could probably use a bit of tweaking as well, admittedly.

even if not- a well-balanced game shouldn't allow its players to become demigods on the battlefield just by winning all one-on-one encounters, and not by the well-executed strategies and use of tactical advantages. Notice how I'm not mad at people who drop arty on the top of your head and get crazy k/ds or get them by insane reflexes.

i must encourage you to look at this video: http://www.twitch.tv/enc_2018/v/334158427?sr=a&t=0s

last few weeks the 'veterans' / jumpshooters had a nice event which is considered as the european championship title in Verdun. Most of the players jumpshoot there, but that's what makes it fun. You don't have the static gameplay of mg's mowing down everyone, snipers camping in their own trench etc. Instead you get a match where pure skill is key to winning. Now tell me honestly, what looks more fun?

looking at this threads i have several questions

1)Pepula, if you only use jumpshooting to get rid of players camping in corners, you will see no problems in making the ''hold breath'' function disabled while jumping, ad you clearly dont need to be 100% accurate to do that. (also, you could use nades.)

2)Jumpshooting once was enabled in tannen, didnt made it more popular. Jumpshooting in tannen isnt the same as jumpshooting in verdun (because of how maps are built and weapons), thats why i have no problems with disabling jumpshooting in tannen but i think it just should be made less accurate in verdun.

3)Games cant be 100% realistic. of course. but trying to include realistic features can give a game more charm. also, you seem to forget that a lot of people on verdun are people interested in history. obviously, when you are interested in history youre more likely to buy a game called ''verdun'' than a COD. if you just want a game with jumpshootin enabled an no realism, get black ops 4 ot BF5. better graphics, bigger developpement team, a ton of budjet, no caring about realism.

4)Not everybody can spend 2000 hours in a GAME. that argument is stupid, all games have occasional players, and all games try to appeal to a large public, because to live a game need to make money, aka to sell.

5)hum, are 1-man MG team unrealistic? for tannen HMGs yeah, but chauchat, lewis, MG08/15 etc were designed to be used by a single man. of course they were also used by 2-man teams, bur the concept of a ww1 lmg/machine rifle is to be also used by 1 man.

6) what about not changing the accuracy of jumpshooting for rifle death match? it would be a hardcore mode relying 100% on personal skill.

Let me end this comment with a quote from the verdun official website.

''Verdun is the first FPS set in an authentic WW1 setting

Merciless trench warfare offers a unique battlefield experience, immersing you and your squad into intense battles of attack and defense.

We have included many historically accurate features such as realistic WW1 weaponry, authentic uniforms, gore, and maps based on the real battlefields of France and Belgium.''


THAT is what i bought when i bought verdun. that is what YOU bought too.

OH BORDEL

wow

I WROTE ALL THAT FOR NOTHING LOL

also, if the new map is in the caures woods, i pay the support thing for tannen.

..when i get the money.

It's fun.  And contrary to "popular" belief, it isn't the "press F to win game" many seem to think it is, for reasons already specified.  Jump shooters are easy to kill, just hone your reaction times.

The developers have also stated ages ago that they're not going to remove it either way, because of the backlash the last time they tried, and the dip in playercount in the immediate aftermath.

It might be fun for experienced jumpshooters, but for the majority of players, it's not fun. I can't believe more players would quit playing a game because of lack of jumpshooting opportunity, than players leaving because of frenetic gunbunnies with 100 kills a match.

devs tried it, and they did see an increase in playerloss. But as I said above, nobody is stopping you from 'getti g gud' and jumpshooting too. It's in the game, might as well use it

ive debated about that with a lot of people, some wanted to remove jumpshooting entierly, others wanted it to stay as it is. I personally think jumpshooting in verdun shouldnt be removed like in tannenberg (would feel weird considering in verdun you jump way more than in tannen), but i think the accuracy when jumping should be reduced. when you are on flanders and get killed by a guy jumpshooting 100 meters away, it can be frustrating, especially for newer/occasional players.

This is a complex topic and i feel like since most people on the support website are experienced players few people will agree, but reducing the accuracy of it (even a little) could be a solution to make it less OP but still a good strategy.

jumpshooting isnt the only thing that makes verdun good, if it was true we all would be on some triple A game where jumpshooting works but that has better graphics.

some people also need to understand that most players dont have hundreds of hours to spend to ''git gud'' and just wanna play every once in a while. let me remind you that 1% of verdun players players reached level 100 and most level 100s arent pro jumpshooters.

I agree! There's nothing wrong with the possibility to fire your rifle whilst jumping, but it's really odd that that this is so accurate that it is a common strategy. I absolutely agree with your last point, the game shouldn't be made to be optimal for those who's done 1000s of hours of playing, it should be made to be as optimal as possible for everyone.

My compromise on the jumpshooting vs no jumpshooting at all:  Just disable Hold Breath while mid-air and ADS'ing.

so you are demanding from the devs to remove any but of skill? Just make it easy and dull so new players can get a positive kd too... 

I only learnt jumpshooting the last yezr, but i have been playing this since it left Stetzm greenlight. Instead ofbasking the same thing over and over it would be beneficial for everybody to just play, and maybe try and do it yourself. 

on the point of accuracy, WW1 weapons were not accurate at all over long distances, so even now we get mostly hitmarkers over 100m, Jumping or not jumping. 

but this debate should really stop imo, people have been didcussing this matter for almost 4 years now but before they lezrned to deal with it, nowadays you just complain in the discussions. Just launch the game and improve your skill, just like every 'jumpshooter' did in their last 1000 hours of Verdun

1)im not asking to remove ''every bit of skill' im just asking to make one strategy less effective

2)WW1 weapons were way more accurate than you seem to think, remember a lot of french snipers used lebels without scopes

3)its not because a debate is old that its obsolete. in 4 years the game has changed

4)i already explained that most players dont have thousands of hours to spend in the game, so find something else to say if you want me to accept the ''git gud'' argument, ive heard that countless times and its still not a good argument alone.

to those who downvote, id really like to hear what you have to say about this topic.

i hope nobody takes that as an insult, but i sometimes feel like a lot of people on this website are the more older players that doesnt care about newer or occasional players. this might be direct, but this game shouldnt be made to please a couple dozen veteran that has been here since the start and played it thousands of hours and who just like making screenshots of their K/D ratios.

(im not saying all players that have been on verdun since a long time are like that, just that some of them are a loud minority who doesnt care about the silent majority of players)

I do not really see the point. This is a really old discussion, the game did fine all things considered with the mechanic. There's no obvious reason to remove it and no compelling evidence that the game would be better off without it. 

I will also add in that the players who use it aren't that hard to kill anyway. In a lot of cases I find them easier to shoot cause of how exposed they make themselves when they jumpshoot. Removing it wouldn't do a whole lot to make the game more accessible. Players who've been here for years are always gonna dominate against new or inexperienced players. 

Also to the idea of a "silent majority", that's rubbish. The majority of players are silent in general. It isn't as if the players who support jumpshooting are all vocal while those against it choose to say nothing. 

i think you misunderstood what i was saying. which is okay, english isnt my native language.

so, to clarify:

1) i dont want to REMOVE it,id like it a bit less accurate.

2)obviously if they were that easy to kill for everyone they wouldnt have 20-1 K/D ratios

3) what i meant is that veteran players are more likely to feel implicated by the support website, occasional players are obviously less representated. i tried to ask what people think of jumpshooting on a few servers. i got a ton of people wanting it removed/less accurate. even though a few servers arent representative of all the verdun playerbase, it still means something.
ive played a little on the US and rarely EU server yet i recognize a lot of names on this site, and from what i remember theyre all way better than me.

Paul44 I disagree with ALL of this. It might be an old discussion but that's not relevant. Yes, there are several obvious reasons already mentioned in this thread, to remove it or atleast nerf it substancially. Of course there is a silent majority, and of course veteran players use this forum a lot more than said majority, and of course jumpshooters are more represented amongst these veteran players.