+3
Fixed in upcoming version

spawnkilling still happens, you just spawn 16 meters away then die

elok 7 months ago in All Platforms / PC • updated by Lilifee the cute fairy 4 months ago 52 3 duplicates

People spawn 16 meters away, but still in peoples sights, spawn killing is unchanged completely, and is to abuse

Game Version:
V288.9801
Reproduction steps:
1.In order to experience this, you have to play the game
2. Get shot
3. Wait
4. Spawn
5. Get spawn killed 
Output Log:
Spawning
BAD, I'M UNSATISFIED

Much like the invisible mg glitch and melee this issue won't be fixed. Probably going to be another lie in the changelog.

Satisfaction mark by elok 6 months ago

Duplicates 3

Under Review

We are investigating the cases in which an attacker has direct view of defenders most forward spawns / very close proximity to their defensive positions. 

The unsafe spawns in this post have been addressed in the level design, this should be updated in the game soon. I'll leave this post as 'under review' as there are more points made outside of what I'm able to fix. Thanks for reporting! -Sjors

glad to see none of the issues being addressed. actually you have just increased these problems by making spawns even more shorter well done

Spawn times or the actual spawn locations?


If you mean spawn times are shorter, that'd be because of the change to never miss a wave when waiting for the death cam to end. (AFAIK, that hasn't changed since the merger.)

Maps were tweaked to make certain views of the spawn obstructed.

well to be frank i have noticed only one tweak which is the change of one spawn in picardie and its pretty terrible solution for the problem overall, I still find it very very hard to give myself a reason to actually get in a trench since i know that a guy i killed to get in might be back in 5 seconds with multiple friends. the spawn times now are absolutely ridiculously low and too close to the trench

Good riddance now you want to change the starting spawns and what a surprise you never even bothered to ask someone who knows how to play the game how to implement them. Well after banning them all i wouldnt have the face to do it either. Please delete my account and everythig i have ever posted i dont want any of my info laying down here unnercessarily

can you perhaps do something rather than take a year like every single minor verdun update

well done insisting to be a fucking malicious tumour till the bitter end

+1

They're more interested in banning people and adding some new sounds. Seems like they've lost all sense of care or interest in this community, well I guess if you're one of those historical x64 people they might listen to you but yeah even people who report bugs get banned. One little slip and *poof*. You can look at the steamcharts and see how bad it is for both games but for whatever reason they'd rather keep pushing away as opposed to reconcile and make an effort to listen to the people who clearly have a greater understanding of the game than anybody else. It's pretty sad cause it didn't have to be like this, I guess it doesn't but they shutdown that censorship thread so they probably won't do anything. We will get more spiels about community guidelines and rules and what not. All the while the game continues to die. The vosges cap speed thread kind of sums up their incompetence. A bug is reported, and then they say it isn't a bug but then finally acknowledge that it is. Too bad they banned Zab for whatever reason, probably called somebody an idiot on the discord or whatever. 

Thank you so much for your feedback! Have you noticed this changing in the latest patch at all? Are there any specific maps, or even specific areas in which this happens often? 


With love,

Tijmen

Nothing changed, spawn on nco or in a trench youre defending and you get spawn killed the same amount as before, every map on frontlines. Even got one meme of a noob to complain after i spawn killed his entire team :DDDD

We'd love to get some input from the community, what do you think the best solution would be here? There is already a check to see if there are no enemy players nearby (within 10 meters), but its very difficult to know if the player you are spawning on is about to be killed. 


We could always spawn you further back, but that would mean more running and less action. 

input from the community? What so you can tell them the game is fine? Make it where you can't spawn anywhere an enemy is watching, just around the corner can be more than 10-15 meters, if theres no where for them to spawn then put them in a safe crater or quiet part of the trench. But im asking too much, spawn killing has been a meme in this game for years, and isn't going to get fixed, i mean look at the meme that is picardies last central powers trench; the spawn is in plain view of everyone and the noobs arent even man enough to use rifles there, they just mow everyone down with a machine gun. OFF TO THE SHREDDER

We will be adding additional analytics to see which spawnpoints have this problem the most. 


Its very difficult to know where an enemy is watching, but its a good idea. I'll do some prototyping tomorrow to see if we can guesstimate this. 


Thanks for posting specific feedback on specific maps, that really helps!

Confirmed

Upcoming update has a system to detect spawnkilling spots. After that we can better pinpoint on the affected spawns and tackle them all. If you happen to know any notorious spots we can make sure to address those first.

Spawnkilling spots?


Just everywhere Players spawning. Some are linked to Standard spawnareas, with some Players Camping there. Or just happen when spawning Close to an NCO.


Few days ago I spawned Standing in the middle of NML. Not prone, nor behind cover. Just fully exposed. Or an enemy just spawned 1 meter next to me. etc etc.

They would be able to fix this a lot easier if they played the game

-1

Everywhere is a spawnkilling spot btw, if you spawn on an nco its a crap shoot, i've spawned inside of enemies on occasion. One time mid trench in picardie, i had the entire enemy team spawn basically on top of me. Whatever was changed trying to get "15 meter" spawns did absoloutely nothing, this "change" only exists in the changelog and you would know this if you played the game.

Thanks for providing additional details. The 15 meter fix did fix some cases where it did not even check properly for the 15m. The issues you are describing are caused by something else and is something we will look into.

Just implement - spawning user cant cause nor suffer damage for 2 (?) seconds


Gives the time needed to react at least.

This is something we already have for artillery(2secs). But for bullets this would be undesirable as giving invincibility for a short time would just create a new issue for the other player for example: 

We already found some cases which we can improve via the heatmap(since it provides the exact situations on how spawnkill occured) and will look in to those.

-1

Why are you lying? There is no spawn protection from arty. I've spawned in and died INSTANTLY from arty.

We will have another look, if it is working correctly. Are you sure it was arty that killed you? Can you perhaps remember the type of arty?

It's happened to me 100s of times with every kind of arty. The spawn protection you're talking about doesn't exist. Stop lying to the community

Yesterday I, as Tommy, spawned 3 meters behind a Landser. How?


Fort Douaumont, this bunker (left side from the Entente's view). Tommies NCO on the Roof of this bunker. I spawned inside the bunker just below my NCO and 3 meters behind this Landser who was covering the entrance.


I was confused, Landser was confused too. After 2 missing lag shots on a non-moving target, besides 250 fps and 25 ping on 3 meters, I got him.


(Not really a spawnkill, but a weird spawn.)

-1

Spawnkilling is essentially part of this game. Actually fixing it would require extensive reworking of the maps and how spawning actually works. 


-1

Some of the greatest offenders for spawnkilling are the first trenches of the CP and Entente when the squad spawn work. As the trenches are straightlines, it's basically a massacre.

We have identified two issues with the current spawning:

1. Exposed spawns
https://gyazo.com/311edfe72301060fb5e17dc92ee1b76c
The heatmap gave us data of users which were killed right after spawning. We gathered this for all maps and located hotspots of spawns which are too exposed. These require mapping changes.

2. Spawning within trenches
The heatmap also indicated that 70% of the spawnkills happen in trenches as also suggested by PoshBrother, this is because the distance when you spawn in a (contested) trench should be higher. This requires a code change that we increase the required distance of an enemy before you spawn. We also will add better sorting of the preferred spawnpoint(closest to goal but also furthest from enemy)

This is being worked on right now and we hope to test this in the next opentesting version. Also we had a look at spawn protection for artillery and it does seem to work but I am guessing that 2 seconds is too short as an artillery is mostly multiple salvos which can last more that 2 seconds. We will have a look at increasing the spawn protection time.

how about just letting people choose where they want to spawn ? 

Would be better since its annoying to have to spawn on obnoxious NCOs or being forced to spawn on a spot where you know enemies are camping.

That would be a different topic which would need these adjustments anyway as this validates the spawnpoints. It would be an interesting discussion to see if it is something that improves Verdun. I believe the reason we never added that in the first place was because this current system makes sure you stick together and always get close to the action wherever possible. I saw that you already suggest that here:

https://support.ww1gameseries.com/communities/1/topics/2259-tannenberg-spawning-system-in-verdun

-1

Yeah it got ignored like every other thread

I've less been the victim of spawnkilling and more of the culprit of it.  Either way it definitely is a problem, without a doubt.

Fixed in upcoming version

We have looked in to this issue and revised the spawning system. Here is what we have done for the upcoming version:

  • Spawn protection against explosions (arty/grenades) raised from 2 to 4 seconds since arty salvos can take a while.


  •  Spawn selection improvements:
    • For selecting spawns, we now require enemies to be at least 25+ meters away if they are in the same sector, otherwise 15+ meters (Used to be 10+ for squadspawn and 15+ for other spawns). This should greatly reduce spawnkilling when inside a contested Verdun-Frontlines sector.
    • Squad spawns (on player) are now allowed within 15 meters (instead of sometimes 8 [when in own sector] or 15 [other]).
    • Sorting: We used to sort based on closest distance to goal (contestedsector/breach point). However we now give spawnpoints a score that takes into account the distance to goal, distance to enemy and distance to squadmates.

Along with that we also created heat maps(https://gyazo.com/311edfe72301060fb5e17dc92ee1b76c) of spawnpoints which are just too exposed and require mapping work. This is not live yet in upcoming version but will be released later. These however account for only 20% of the spawnkills while the code change should improve for the other 80% of the cases.


Be aware that this change doesn't instantly apply when you are playing on the opentesting version, the host of the match needs to be on the opentesting version to have the new spawning behavior since the host dictates the spawning behavior

This is now live on current default version: V289.10485. If you still have issues please let us know! Thanks for reporting.


Be aware that this change may not be reflected yet the coming days as some users still need to update and if they are hosting they will still have old spawn behavior.

Still spawning next to ememies and getting spawn killed immediately. Not fixed.

Normally I would write a long response, but I see no reason to. Simple fact of the matter is those stats are just completely wrong and do not reflect the current state of spawn killing at all.

Well this is all based on playerdata. A spawnkill was defined as a kill by a bullet within 2 seconds of the spawn. Perhaps you have a different definition of a spawnkill? Would love to hear what you are experiencing so we can have a look.

Well i guess i start spawn killing them after 2.1 seconds

What is your definition of a spawnkill? How much time should pass before it is no longer a spawnkill? Or is the issue something different? Do you have any examples that you can share?

Spawn killing is dying as a direct result of a spawn. It takes longer than 2 seconds to get oriented then run out of a spawn. The central powers hq sector on picardie has spawns in full view of the enemy as does the first central powers trench on argonne. Takes longer than 2 seconds to wipe an entire spawn wave. You learn the spawn killing spots by playing the game, actual frontlines games, not those joke bot matches you call "playtesting." This isn't an issue that will be solved with some kind of heat map and map modifications, this can only be solved by changing how spawning works completely. Is asking for you guys to play the game for more than 30 minutes really too much to ask?

Play one frontlines game, you'll see that spawn killing is still a massive issue. Oh wait, i forgot asking the devs to play their own game is too much to ask.

I've been spawn killing just as much and still spawn close to enemies

this fix has been rigorously play tested for five minutes on a bot match and has been fixed entirely. Be more greatful to our great god m2h

Fixed in upcoming version

More improvements are upcoming for the maps.


Also, do remember, there are still level changes to be implemented that aren't live currently.

Is there a thread regaring map modifications?


Would like to learn why Argonne, was pro-Entente designed since release, was modified to be more pro-Entente designed.